Jerry Shirley (Humble Pie, Fastway) Interview

In the early 70s, few bands rocked harder and drew bigger crowds than Humble Pie. Their loud, sweaty brand of blues and boogie infused rock n’ roll spoke to a generation of kids hellbent on hellraising, paving the way for all hard rock and heavy metal bands to follow. From Aerosmith and Van Halen, to KISS and The Black Crowes, there are few bands who weren’t directly influenced by Humble Pie. The ones that claim they aren’t are lying. Taking this historic importance into consideration, it was an honor to sit down with original Humble Pie drummer and co-founder Jerry Shirley. In this exclusive interview, Shirley looks back upon 50 years of Smokin’, the band’s legendary (and sometimes infamous) shows, and his plan to honor Humble Pie’s legacy in the years to come. “C’mon Everybody”!

Greetings Jerry and welcome to Defenders of the Faith! How are you doing today?

Jerry Shirley: I’m fine thank you! It’s good to Zoom and meet you! I love it!

It’s great to meet you too. There’s a lot going on in the world of Humble Pie right now, so we’re just gonna hop right into it. Last week marked the 50th anniversary of Smokin’. I’d like to start by congratulating you on that milestone.

JS: Thank you! I’m very proud of the moment and I’m very proud, especially proud of that record. That’s one of my two favorite studio albums with the band. That and Rock On before it, the last one Peter (Frampton) did, I think are the two best Humble Pie studio albums. I loved it. I had a great time making that record.

What was the band’s attitude going into the studio for Smokin’? For me, this always seemed to be the album where everything came together. Obviously here in America it went platinum and received rock radio airplay. What separated this album from past Humble Pie releases?

JS: Yeah, well Peter had left, and that was devastating. We tried to hide how shattered we were about him leaving. He was a gentleman about it. Steve (Marriott), may he rest in peace, was more verbally upset. I always remained close friends with Peter and still am to this day. I understand why he felt he had to leave, but the fact is he was gone at a moment when we were just about looking like we were gonna take off. Sure enough, the live album (Performance Rockin’ the Fillmore) came out and did take off, but we were a three piece. We could not find the right guitar player. We almost decided to go out as a three piece, but Steve just didn’t feel quite confident enough, although he was a perfectly capable guitar player and there were great three piece bands. At that moment in time, we needed a guitar player who could work with Steve and do duel guitars.

A bunch of guys were suggested and almost auditioned and chose not to or did come. Mick Abrahams from Jethro Tull, bless his heart, came with his guitar. The three of us had just started to write “The Fixer” or “Sweet Peace and Time”, one of those two. We were rehearsing it *laughs*. We finished and he said, “I can’t add a thing to that. You don’t need me! Go ahead!” *laughs* He was a good friend also, Mick, a lovely man. Then there was the possibility of Rick Derringer. That didn’t pan out. Joe Walsh, that didn’t pan out.

Then out of nowhere, Clem (Clempson) calls Steve. Steve pretended to not be Steve because he didn’t know anything about Clem. He rushed to the record store and bought the live album that Colosseum had just released. There was a slow blues on it with Clem featured and it just blew Steve away. Steve gets back, calls him, and now he’s Steve. Before you know it, Clem’s rehearsing with us the next day. As far as we were concerned, he’d joined the band, but we hadn’t given him a chance to tell Colosseum that we’d nicked him *laughs*, but that worked out as well.

What happened was we went out on the road right away with a new lineup and some new songs in the repertoire. That was what ended up being Smokin’. That’s why it felt so good. We’d been playing it for a while. The album ended up being just so much fun because we’d been on the road. We gelled as people and musicians. We had the perfect combination of instant jams that turned into great records, one take and it’d turn out great, and material that we’d been doing live anyway. We were rolling. We were Smokin’! That’s how the name came about! Chuck Kay came to listen to listen to the album. He was the head of A&M’s publishing, great guy. Not sure if he’s still with us, but anyway, he was a lovely man. He listened to “Hot ‘n’ Nasty” and said, “Man, that’s smokin’!” We said, “Thank you! That’s our title!” It was just a fun, fun record to make and it had all that road work in it.

How did the band approach songwriting? Would Steve or Peter or another member of the band come in with a fully fleshed out song, or would the band come up with songs while jamming in the studio?

JS: It was both. That’s exactly right. Both of those things happened. It was one of the two. As we developed, we got more into the start a jam and turn it into a song mode, but at the very beginning, Steve had a bunch of songs. Peter was still developing as a songwriter, but had a few ready to go. Even I had a couple of songs. We were all encouraged to write. Greg (Ridley) could write. I couldn’t sing for toffee *laughs*, but I could write a decent tune. They could interpret it or I could add to the writing. Those were the two ways we did it, and the ones that were the most fun, I’ve gotta say, were the ones that happened on the spot. I think “Hot ‘n’ Nasty” is the best example on the Smokin’ record of that.

That’s amazing, because that song, and the whole album for that matter, is so organic and flows so naturally, more so than almost any other hard rock band of that era.

JS: It’s also how it was recorded. We recorded it at Olympic Studios in studio 1, the big room. It was set up as a live show. The backline and the drum kit were on a riser in the middle. It was recorded by Alan O’Duffy and Keith Harwood, may he rest in piece. Alan’s still with us, but Keith died many years ago, bless him. Both were brilliant, brilliant Glyn Johns types. They all were trained from the same guy at IBC and then Olympic. Keith Grant I think was his name, the guy who owned Olympic. Anyway, they all recorded in the same way. Let the room record what’s the sound of the band.

To give you an example, when you listen to a drumkit, you don’t go up to the hanging tom, put your ear right next to it, and say, “Go on and play it, will ya?” You stand back and hear the drumkit breathe. That’s what those type of guys did. That’s how that sound that I used to get happened. The same thing with Kenney Jones, same thing certainly with John Bonham. He was the biggest example of it. Keith Moon too! Great drum sounds, au naturel *laughs*!

To commemorate this landmark anniversary and the band’s legacy, you’ve put together a new lineup of Humble Pie. Who’s currently in the band and how did this all come together?

JS: Two years before Greg Ridley sadly passed away, we put a lineup together that was Greg, myself, Bobby Tench who had been in Humble Pie mk. II or mk. III around 1980 with myself, Steve, and Anthony Jones. We put this lineup together along with Dave Colwell. “Dave Bucket” is his nickname. He’s been with Bad Company for years and years. He loved the band. His first big live band he saw as a young man was Humble Pie at Hyde Park, I think.

Anyway, he and I became great friends. we made a record called Back on Track in 2002. We took that on the road a little bit. Sadly, Greg got sick and passed away, so we put the idea to bed for a while. Right before the pandemic, in 2018, I had developed arthritis in the hips, so I had my hips replaced. I found out once they’d been replaced that I could walk and function great. I could hardly walk. It was that bad, but I could still play drums. Once they’d been fixed, I could walk right, but I couldn’t play drums the same or not as long. It counted me out of being on the road for long periods.

We looked at the possibility of recruiting like minded musicians. We found Bobby Marks, who’s the drummer. Dave Colwell did the recruiting really. He knew a lot of these guys from before. He got Jimmy Kunes, who had been with Savoy Brown and Cactus, as the lead singer. We got Ivan Bodley on bass, who’s a wonderful player. He’s about 10 feet tall, which is unusual for Humble Pie members *laughs*. James “Roto” Rotondi is the other guitar player. It’s a five piece. They went out in 2018. It was well received. We had a couple of gripes on social media, but there’s so many bands now that the public don’t realize are using the name as a brand, but are keeping the music alive by putting new lineups out there that are officially held together by the original members, or some of them.

Foreigner are a perfect example. They’ve been out for years with no original members. A couple of them show up occasionally. Mostly, it’s because we’re getting old *laughs*! You can only stay out there that long. I also wanted to protect my hearing. I can’t play with earphones. I’ve lost a lot of hearing and I wanted to be able to hear my grandchildren as I got older, to be honest. So we’re putting this new lineup together to eventually go out there, not as a tribute band, but to perform the legacy of Humble Pie’s music. Let’s put it like that. It’s an officially sanctioned new Humble Pie lineup.

It’s a good point you make about these bands getting older. I believe it was an interview with Tobias Forge of Ghost where he said people will pay to see orchestras play Beethoven, and nobody gets mad when the marquee reads “Beethoven Live”. What happens in another 50 to 100 years? Let’s face it: This music is timeless. It’s been around this long and will continue to be so for that much longer. So what happens when people want to hear the music of Humble Pie or another band of that era live? You’re going to use the name because that was the band who created that music intially.

JS: Yeah! That’s absolutely right. I actually had that same thought when we started doing this. No one complains about the classical composers. Some of them died before their music became well known, or their music became better known after they passed on. Mind you, some of them didn’t. Wasn’t it Beethoven that wrote his first symphony when he was 3 years old? Flashy sod *laughs*! None of us, when we started playing in the 60s into the 70s, had any idea that this music would last this long. We all thought the average timespan for a band was about three years at best. Here are 50 and 60 years later.

God bless The Stones. They’re still able to do it, albeit sadly losing Charlie (Watts), but they’ve got a great replacement. He knows Charlie’s playing. The ones who can still themselves do it, Roger (Daltrey) and Pete (Townshend) with The Who, God bless ’em. But it’s a way of continuing the legacy of the music of each band, as long as it’s run properly by the original members or someone associated with such. I’m the original member that has the rights to the name. That’s just the way it panned out. Peter’s got his own career. He supports me 100% in what we do. We discuss how we function and so on. Clem is out there with Colosseum now. It’s all trucking along and times change. The people change. Onwards!

The legacy of Humble Pie’s music and live shows are practically intertwined. You guys were well known for your legendary and sometimes infamous shows. I’d love to touch on a handful of them, starting with the band’s two night stand at the Fillmore East, which resulted in the masterpiece Performance Rockin’ the Fillmore East. I tell everybody that Frampton Comes Alive! is the second best live album Peter ever did. This record here is #1. Now with those two shows, were there different setlists? How much of each night made it onto the record?

JS: What we did was years later, about 6 or 7 years ago, we put out all of the shows and called it The Complete Recordings. It was pretty much the same show every night, but there were four versions. We would jam so much, that each version would go in many different places. While the basic form was the same, there was quite a lot of variants. Peter and I worked together on remixing those four shows. What we got back then, when we had to choose, it was strange years later when we listened to them all. We were trying to remember why we chose one against the other. There might have been a slight…maybe Peter thought he played guitar better on one version, or I thought I held the groove better on another. Steve might have sung better slightly on one version.

Really, we could’ve taken any one of the four shows, mixed it, and put it out there, but we cherry picked the best bits. It was worth doing. We nearly screwed it up. When we first took the tapes to London to mix on our own, we had never mixed a live album before. So we mixed it as if it was a studio album. We left the audience out *laughs*! We left out all the ambiance mics, that Eddie Kramer had intentionally recorded beautifully. All of the ambient sound of that beautiful room, we left it off and tried to make it sound like a studio album. It was horrible! We didn’t even include the applause for heaven’s sake! Our then manager came and listened to it. He said, “What have you done?!”

We took it to New York to Electric Ladyland and had Eddie Kramer, who was one of, again, of that breed of great engineers who knew us well and recorded it that night. We left the mixing up to him. It was mostly Peter, but then also Steve and sometimes all four of us, who would go in and be the band representative while Eddie was mixing it. I have to say, to give credit to Peter, he did about 60% of the mixing with Eddie, if not more. Plus, you’ve got all four members in there and you get in the way. You gotta have focus. Eddie pretty much said to us, “Fuck off! I need one of you to tell me what you want.” *laughs*

It got remixed. We cut and chopped and changed. I remember we took one of Peter’s solos out of one version of “I Walk on Gilded Splinters” and put it into another night’s version. The amazing part of it was, back then, we didn’t have electronic tuners, so we were all tuning by ear with a tuning fork or harmonica. We certainly weren’t playing to a click track. The tuning and the tempo were perfect, even though they were two different nights entirely. We couldn’t believe it. It was like, “Okay, that works!” It turned out to be, as you said, the greatest live album Peter played on. He’s played on the most successful and the best sounding. I don’t think he’ll mind me saying that because his album is great. You can’t argue with 18 million copies or whatever it was.

A little over a month later, you’d return to New York City to open for Grand Funk Railroad at Shea Stadium. Was that the biggest show the band had played thus far?

JS: In status, it was the biggest show I suppose. In terms of actual amount of people it wasn’t. We’d just done Hyde Park in London the week before with Grand Funk. There was a quarter of a million people there. It was huge. It was at least 250,000. Some say it was way more than that, but it was Hyde Park completely full. Then we did Shea Stadium, which held then about 55,000. That was a remarkable evening because we were the opening act. It was Grand Funk’s show, but we certainly grabbed the audience and shook them up a bit.

We got a bit of luck. It started to rain. It was a bit dangerous. In those days, you’d have to leave the stage if it rained too much. You didn’t have wireless. Steve just seized the moment and said to the audience, “I know it’s pouring with rain but we don’t give a fuck! We’re gonna rock n’ roll you anyway, all night long!” The place went nuts. It stopped raining and we had them in the palm of our hands from that point onwards. Great night!

Are the rumors true that there were so many kids jumping up and down they feared the structure was going to collapse on itself?

JS: That was in Pittsburgh with Alice Cooper! They were jumping up onstage. There was a runway, like they do a lot nowadays, but there was a runway up in front of the stage at Three Rivers Stadium. It was only really built to support artists and/or Steve Marriott. We were the special guests on Alice’s show. Steve went out there and did his wind the crowd up bit. Towards the end, some of them started to get up on to this thing, jumping up and down. They were very concerned that it was gonna fall over. The lovely part of that show was afterwards. Before he went on, Alice came to our dressing room. We had never met him. We hadn’t asked to see him. He invited himself in and was leaning on the doorway. Back then he was still drinking. Like me, he’s been sober many years now. He said, “How the fuck do you expect me to follow that?” He said it so beautifully *laughs*. He was a very nice man, lovely man.

He’s great. I’ve had the pleasure of meeting him a couple times. He’s got a heart of gold.

JS: Absolutely.

Now this next story is a bit of Chicago rock n’ roll folklore that I’ve heard many times over the years. The story is that in 1973, Humble Pie headlined the International Amphitheatre and played well beyond the city’s imposed curfew, until nearly 1 in the morning. Is this true?

JS: It rings a bell. I have a feeling that something was going on. They were trying to stop us and they were trying to cut the wires to cut the power. That is somewhat true. I think, because we went over, we had to pay some overages to the unions and things like that to keep it going. Our management and the building’s management were at it hammer and tongs backstage while we were still rocking and rolling. That does ring a bell. I had forgotten about it, but yes, I’m pretty sure that is what happened.

The two Chicago 70s shows that get talked about the most to this day are UFO when they recorded Strangers in the Night and that Humble Pie one I just mentioned. I’ve heard so many old schoolers say you kept playing and playing, something along the lines of 5 encores.

JS: It’s quite possible! Back in the early 70s, encores were a new thing and they were genuine. They weren’t set up as part of the show. You only did them if you earned them. Whereas now, it’s pretty much, “We’ll do this, this, and this song. And what we’re gonna do for the encore…” It’s all organized. It wasn’t like that back then. If the crowd kept asking you back for more, you kept coming back until you ran out of songs *laughs* which for us was not long because we didn’t have millions of songs. It’s just some of them were 25 minutes long *laughs*!

Even on Rockin’ the Fillmore, “Gilded Splinters” and “Rolling Stone” are two entire album sides.

JS: Yep! “Gilded Splinters” would go on some nights for 30+ minutes. In fact, I think the one that went on the original album is 24 minutes. I’m pretty sure when we did the remixes years later, we found a few extra minutes here and there *laughs*. What a great time. The Fillmore East, I have to say, was the greatest sounding room anywhere in the world. It really did sound magnificent in there. That’s why so many live albums were recorded there. It was wonderful.

How big was Fillmore East? I know it wasn’t that big of a room.

JS: It wasn’t that big. It was barely 2,000 people. Maybe 1,800. 2,000 at most. I’m sure Bill (Graham), bless his heart, would cram a few more in there *laughs*. There’s a lovely story that one of the old promoters talks about with Bill where he did two shows at Winterland in San Francisco. I can’t remember who the band was, but both sold out on a Friday and a Saturday. On the Friday night, it sold out and he’s looking, “There’s a lot of people here.” On the second night, there’s way more people, but Bill said it was the same amount of people as the night before. The agent confronted him and said, “Bill, it’s Saturday night out there! There’s way more people!” Bill said, “Saturday night, bigger people!” *laughs* Bill Graham was something else. He was a remarkable man to work with and you didn’t want to get on the wrong side of him either. He was ferocious, but he loved the bands. He always worked for the bands and wanted the best for them. Great guy.

It was also in ’73, about 90 minutes north of Chicago in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, that Humble Pie headlined Summerfest. During this show, bonfires were lit, the beer tents were raided, a riot broke out, and over 300 kids were arrested. What happened during the show that culminated in this event?

JS: I remember that night probably as well or better than any night we played anywhere because we broke the record for the attendance, which had been set the year before by Stephen Stills at 76,000 people. As we’re driving in from the airport, the reports are coming in of how many people are there. “It’s nearly as many as last year. It’s gone past last year.” Anyway, it got to 130,000 people. They decided to give beer away because it was a hot day, and then they ran out. Then beer cans and things started getting thrown around. There was a bit of a riot that went down. I remember we had to get out of Dodge pretty quick because you came to the stage on a boat which came to the back of the stage from the lake.

We went down there storming. We had just been told a week or two before that Led Zeppelin had broke the record for the biggest attendance for a single act with a paid audience in Tampa with 56 or 57,000 people, which was bigger than The Beatles at Shea Stadium or something like that. Anyway, we’re all excited. “We just broke their record!” We got onto our agent, Frank Barsalona, and said, “Let’s publicize this!” He said, “I don’t think you wanna do that.” Led Zeppelin were the biggest band on God’s earth. The difference was their show was just them, whereas Summerfest had a couple opening acts. I think J. Geils Band was on as well, and we were the headliners. We couldn’t claim it to be just us, although we were the main attraction and it was more people. But it was an almighty mess afterwards with this riot. I think we closed the Summerfest for years because of what happened that night. I don’t think they had another one for a few years after.

They did continue to have Summerfest, but they banned rock acts for quite a few years.

JS: Is that what it was?

Yeah, I don’t think it was until the late 70s when they realized the family acts they were getting weren’t drawing, so they got Judas Priest, UFO, and Journey as headliners. It was their way of saying, “Rock is back at Summerfest.”

JS: So the story you’re telling me, from what you heard happened was that it was a riot and what else?

There were bonfires lit and the beer tents were raided.

JS: Right, yeah. I have vague memories of bonfires, but certainly beer tents were used to their extreme *laughs*. I think some fences were knocked down as well and that was part of the riot side of it. Great gig though! The crowd went very, very wild!

Despite being eligible for induction since 1994, Humble Pie have not been nominated once for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. What are your thoughts on this and do you think the band will ever be inducted?

JS: I don’t know. Someone just recently published a list of bands that have not been even nominated, let alone inducted. I think it’s criminal that a band like us is not in there when you look at some of the acts that are in there. Does Madonna have anything to do with rock n’ roll? Hello? I got nothing against the lady. She’s very talented, but that’s pop, isn’t it? There’s so many bands that should be and are not in there. Even our own Steve Marriott is in there, but they put him in through the back door. “Oh yes, he was in The Small Faces, but we’re gonna nominate Faces and include them too.” That’s almost insulting. It’s not an insult because he’s in there. He deserved to be in there for his work with The Small Faces, but he deserves to be in there just as much for his work with Humble Pie, especially in America for heaven’s sake. Peter Frampton’s not on there! Bad Company, Little Feat, it’s unbelievable. It’s beyond the pale.

It is, especially when we look at the American bands that are in there who owe so much to Humble Pie. Aerosmith, Guns N’ Roses, Metallica: If it weren’t for bands such as yourself, they may have never even been.

JS: Yeah, and a lot of them get nominated and inducted on their first time around. We’ve gone two times around! It’s 25 years from your first release. Our first release was now 53 years ago. Our first single came out in 1969. It’s not right. Do I care? I’ll tell you what. I don’t know if you can see it, but on the wall behind me there is an award from the Classic Drummers Hall of Fame. I’m very proud that I am in that. I was nominated and inducted into that the second time around. All the Buddy Riches and John Bonhams went first time around. I was on the the ballot the second year. It is what it is.

I don’t like to say, “We should be in there.” because I’m not a boastful person. I’m proud of what we did and we were a fantastic, great band. I had literally the best seat in the house, sitting there playing away with all that going on around. But we did influence so many of the bands that has subsequently got in there or should be. Chad Smith is a dear friend now, but he’s also a huge fan of Humble Pie. Are the (Red Hot) Chili Peppers in there yet?

I’m almost positive they are.

JS: I think they are. I don’t know about The Black Crowes, but if they aren’t they should be, and so on. I don’t know. It’s not right. I just think they don’t like us. It’s run by the people that run Rolling Stone and they never liked us. This interview isn’t for Rolling Stone, is it? *laughs*

No way! If they don’t like you, you must be doing something right!

JS: Well yeah! There is that to it. I don’t know. Who knows? Maybe one day it’ll happen, but if it doesn’t, I’m OK with it. So what. It’s almost cool not to be in there. What Dolly Parton just did was fantastic. Good for her. “Thanks very much, but I don’t qualify. I’m not in rock n’ roll.” She was so honest about it, but yeah. We’ll see!

For more information on Humble Pie, visit www.humblepieofficial.com.